Having a tankless water heater is an energy-efficient way of getting hot water. (std. Both options use less energy than a continuously-running system. Hi Christopher, not really. Create a chart to regulate hot water usage. As an Amazon Associate we earn from qualifying purchases. There are no error codes showing. Press either the Up and the Down button to switch between any of these recirculation settings: These are the 3 most often recommended brands for tankless water heaters with recirculation pumps. My navien furance is producing hot water but not circulating Connect a regular garden hose to the hot side service valve. Not only that, by now you should know how to turn it off and why its important to do so. A while ago we had a plumber/friend install a Navien tankless water heater. By rejecting non-essential cookies, Reddit may still use certain cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform. Lets start by looking at how these pumps actually work: If it takes forever for the hot water to start running, it usually means that there is a long pipe between a boiler (or a hot water heater or tankless water heater) and the faucet. You also have to flush the heat exchanger. (+ Installation Costs), How Many Amps Does A Tankless Water Heater Use? here are some problems that you may have to deal with in the future or have experienced already primarily found in older Navien heater models; Though not a common occurrence, it is still essential to know how to identify these issues. If your system displays this code, you need to confirm the water pressure is within good ranges. Minimising the environmental effects of my dyson brain. Purchase and install a rocker switch or "doorbell" style buttons to activate the NRCR "on-demand" mode to prime the pump for use only when you want it. If we dont use it, we waste a lot of water. A place for plumbing advice and help. What parts does a home water recirculation pump include, and where to install it. Because a water recirculating pump provides us instant hot water. Turns out, make sure you isolate the recirculation pump from the vibration. The circulation return needs to come from a loop at an end of the hot supply line. Navien tankless water heater recirculation | 2016-04-01 | Plumbing and I have 5 connections including the recirculation in. Hot Water Recirculating Pump: What You Should Know - Best San Diego All you have to know is how to turn it off. Navien NR-240A heating issues Heating Help: The Wall For most existing homeowners, integrating a recirculating home pump comfort system on top of the existing piping makes much more sense: Heres why this is the most popular type of hot water recirculating pump in homes: You use the existing water pipe alone. Always on checks in every 30 minutes and turns on the heat recirculation if the water is 9 degrees under the water goal temp. Sure there is likely some distance between the recirculation line and the fixture which should me some time till hot water reaches. Second, you can use a flex connector to isolate the pump. Hopefully its clear which is which when Im down there. Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. Navien Flow Sensor. Turn off the unit and check the valve's wiring and condition. Contents show Does the thing have a 'vacation' mode? Hi. When we dont have to use it, why keep it on? Then what are we waiting for? If you'd like to support the site, please allow ads. Check the wiring and cold water inlet two thermistors and make sure both are in good condition. The water heater will not provide hot water instantly. With two pipes, you can create a loop between the water heater and faucets. Is this noise normal coming from my Navien tankless heater? You can crack open the manual for your tankless heater and check if it comes with that option. Our goal here at GridSub is to help you find viable solutions to different off-grid problems. Thats 2,920 gallons of water per year wasted. Make sure to follow the required instructions before and after you've turned it off for your safety. Of course, the most important part is the pump itself, so well start with that: These are the standard building blocks of every recirculation pump for getting hot water quickly. Navien's patented ComfortFlow system is the first to include a buffer tank, recirculation pump and fine-tuned controls into a tankless water heater, resolving the cold-water sandwich effect* and issues of minimal flow rates commonly found in other tankless water heaters. Its not exactly normal. The best answers are voted up and rise to the top, Not the answer you're looking for? I connected the Hot Button control board to the main PCB per the instructions. Turn off the device for half an hour and confirm everything is working correctly. In large systems, however, it may be advantageous to use controlled pumps to enable adjustment of the flow when starting up the system and to be able to apply temperature control. Why do small African island nations perform better than African continental nations, considering democracy and human development? If you have a Navien tankless water heater this can be done by simply pressing a . $257.16. Confirm the thermistor and wiring is in good condition. Working well so far. Therefore, the total peak demand of hot water needed is the ideal size of the heater you should get. It means the circulation pump is not working correctly. But in my case its significant amount of time and it only really gets hot if I fully open the hot water at that faucet otherwise it is luke warm. Shut off the appliance for half an hour and then restart. We want to reduce waste in using water given our well situation. Locate the power button and press it to turn on the heater. I have alos checked my HeatBox settings to ensure the temp is set high enough for my domestic supply (set to around 120 degrees). The recirculation timer is set to operate ever 15 minutes, even though we are often not at the property. The filter is located at the top left of the water heater. This depends on how long you leave it on and how often you use it. Learn more about Stack Overflow the company, and our products. Obviously, everybody loves immediate hot water from their faucets but this luxury can be quite expensive. Where does the circulation return line tie in, and where is this in relation to the Naviien unit, other fixtures, and appliances in the home? That is a premium service however. That installation is incorrect. Is there a way to tell if the cold pipe is circulatory/return line or cold water from the mains? It worked perfectly. Close the isolation valves to the cold-supply and recirculation lines. The E760 informs you that its time to flush your heater. The buffer tank eliminates the "cold water sandwich" effect and issues of minimum flow rates commonly found in other tankless water heaters. This happens when you have a huge heater and lower gas output. Lets outline them here: To determine if installing a hot water recirculation pump makes sense for your situation, we have to check the pros and cons. This breaks down the scale and flushes out the sediment. Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience. Theoretically Correct vs Practical Notation. Not really. Not sure I am understanding. Home Improvement Stack Exchange is a question and answer site for contractors and serious DIYers. . Continue with Recommended Cookies. You will see in the photo that the cold water valve shuts off water into the domestic water inlet but doesn't have a shut off into the circulation water inlet. If we take that the average price of water is $0.18/gallon (according to Statistas 2019 study), heres how much you can save on water with a recirculation pump: Water Savings = 2,920 gallons/year * $0.18/gallon = $525.60/year. 10.6 Maintenance 10.7.3 NPE-180A/240A Pump P-Q Curve The Navien NPE-180A and NPE-240A water heaters that are used . The only problem you have is there is no check valves in place check valves or like stop signs that direct traffic check valves, direct to flow of water. That install is exactly as specified in the newer manuals. This chapter will reveal all the possible culprits that cause the recirculation pump of your Navien to make a humming noise. Here are some of the leading causes of cold water production; Which means there isnt enough time for the water to heat up. Well, If you overuse your pump, it will start malfunctioning. Return this item for free. The error code E445 tells about the defect of the bypass mixing valve. We have to keep the valve on and slowly hot water comes out. Then, use the arrows to set the desired temperature. It tells you about the abnormality of the external tank thermistor. Navien ComfortFlow is the first and only system that incorporates a built-in insulated buffer tank and recirculation pump. First, place a thick rubber between the pump and anything it will be mounted on. When you turn on the shower or a faucet, do you get hot water instantly? While you may have a general understanding of the listed electrical issue above, you should not attempt to handle any electrical work unless you are a licensed electrician. Check to see if the water valves are open. The average electric tankless water heater needs at least 120 amps to work. I guess the recirculation line will be the only one that is copper. After draining a few hot water tanks over the years, removing sediment, will the cold water now possibly have some sediment and/or taste issues. It looks like you're using an ad blocker. qc = the circulating water flow [m3/s] To remedy this issue, turn off the heater for some time and restart it. A hot water recirculating pump will save you money, especially if you have a larger family. Also, as I'm taking a closer look at it, I'm concerned that some key things may be amiss. Navien Recirculation Pump Noise [4 Easy Solutions] Allow it to dry and then fix it back. Quite surprisingly for most homeowners, the biggest problem with this type of recirculation pump is getting cold water. Yes, you can turn it off by yourself. Hathaspace Smart True HEPA Air Purifier Reviews, 4+6 Best Whole-House Dehumidifiers (Ducted, Portable), 4 Quietest Dehumidifiers (Best Bedroom Dehumidifiers): 52.1 dB Or Lower, energy-efficient way of getting hot water. This is the system you can see in the photos above. New build - tankless hot water heater - recirculation pump needed? - Houzz Press the M (menu) button on the front panel and choose the 1. This is known as recirculating home pump comfort system (Type #2) and its the most popular way to get hot water quickly. Let the vinegar cycle through the cold side for 45 minutes. There is some issue with the front panel key. air), Sensible Heat (BTU/hr) = 1.1 x CFM x t (std. Answer: It really depends on your model type. Press the Power button on the front panel to turn on the water heater. All you have to do is browse through our guides, answers and personal experience documentations to find out what you should (or shouldn't) do when going off the grid. Browse other questions tagged, Start here for a quick overview of the site, Detailed answers to any questions you might have, Discuss the workings and policies of this site. That means that all the costs of the hot water circulation pump are covered by the water savings. Older Navien heater models are prone to flow sensor issues. There is a circulator pump, but it still takes a long time for hot water to reach the upstairs bathrooms. This is done every time you close the faucet. Recirculation valve for use with NPE-A series tankless water heaters Designed for recirculation of domestic hot water in applications where a dedicated return line is not available. Step 1 Remove the plug from the socket on the end of the wire that connects to your circulator pump. Once the tank is thoroughly drained, clean the base of the heater. Air in the line: If there has been a power outage or air has gotten into the line for another reason, the pump can make a lot of noise. I am guessing that he only returned the HOT line, hence the delayed time in "INSTANT HOT", as the Naviens are sold as well as there 96% efficiency!! The only place that quickly gets hot (and really hot) is the guest bath which happens to be right next to the water heater. Turning off your water recirculating pump reduces damage. Is the plumbers reasoning valid here? The cold water pipe coming from the wall goes into the domestic water inlet on the tankless heater, as it should. Understanding Navien Recirculating Water Heater - Heating Help: The Wall If any particular ad is your REASON for blocking ads, please let us know. You will not get hot water instantly. I recall it was p23 but it was definitely larger than p20. Categories Home Improvement, Patio, Lawn & Garden, Plumbing, Tools, Water Valve Handle Broke Off? Second, you can use a flex connector to isolate the pump. On top of that, the recirculating pumps also return the cold water in the pipes back to the heater. After using this amount of time, hardware gets old and starts to malfunction. How To Turn Off A Water Recirculating Pump? I have the newest version pcb since I just bought the tankless. You can replace the sensor if needed. The pump will cost you $200 to install, $5.50-$32 to operate, will waste $160-$400 per year and will save you $4-$50 on your water bill. Rather than using the hard wired door bell style push button that comes with the kit, I bought this remote control unit (. Where did you find that info? Make sure to follow our instructions properly for the right application. Allow the vinegar to circulate through the heater for a minimum of one hour (longer if the pump runs at less than four gallons per minute). To remedy the issue, consider increasing the gas supply to the heater. There are several ways to do it. I have a clog, When the faucet is on the unit is indicating flow rate of 1.4 GPM which seems plenty and the recirculation mode is set to external & always on. Thanks for confirming and letting me know about the potential damage to the circulating pump as that hadn't occurred to me. As a result, the stuff will rub against the wall of the pump and produce a hum like a refrigerator when you turn the unit on. That means that this household wasted 8 gallons of water per day just waiting for hot water. Examine and clean the filter in a cold water inlet. Examine and confirm the pressure sensor and wiring are in good condition. Great article!! Similarly, if the return from the loops is mixing with the boiler loop system and cooling off the water before it gets sent to the recirculation pump, you will face this problem. Correcting Navien Tankless Hot Water Heater Installation, We've added a "Necessary cookies only" option to the cookie consent popup, Tankless water heater - not consistent hot water output, Plumbing Manifold Use With a Tankless Hot Water Heater, No hot water if hot water recirculator pump is shut off, warm water only when we replaced the hot water heater with a tankless heater. Can I swap out the mainboard in the NR240A to an NPE240A board to get all that features? I agree the user manuals are very helpful. My pipes arent big enough 2. It would be nice to get the hot water to the faucet especially the shower in the morning as quickly as possible. Otherwise, turn it off. Remove the front cover of the water heater. Also, did you wire the PB from the Hot Button kit or only use the remote? Costs associated with hot water circulation pumps (parts + installation + DIY savings). Now, when installed, the recirculating pump makes it seem that the hot water starts flowing right away like magic. Additionally, you can install a 5-micron filter in the water inlet right before the heater to remove impurities from the water. Its clearly not always running as I can see it says standby on the display most of the time. Privacy Policy. Is there the same solution for NR240A? Not Mounted The Pump Securely or Isolate It, Navien Tankless Water Cycles On And Off [5 Easy Solutions]. It could be open or shorted. It sounds awful and not like any other recirculating pump I've ever heard. Then turn on the heater and then your pump. I think it's 100F. Get a sump pump and connect the cold service hose to the sump pump. A hot water recirculation pump can be sized for a given system using the following formulas: Water flow qc = /T x 4200 You can turn it off during work hours, over the night, when you go on vacations, and so on. At the same time, someone is in the kitchen doing the dishes. We have some suggestions for you if you want to buy the best wifi sockets. Hi Howy, well, the circulating pumps are usually powered by electricity, so they dont use gas. Thats why turning off your pump is important when youre not using it. It does save you water but it also costs you a bit of electricity. NAVIEN NPE-180A SERVICE MANUAL Pdf Download | ManualsLib However, the plumber branched this off into the circulation water inlet. If your pump does this, then it is to be expected, otherwise it sounds like the hot and cold are mixing at some point and you'd need to find out where . A water recirculating pump is also similar to this. If you fail to stop the noise after trying all the steps I mentioned, I bet there is a complex problem with the unit. The short answer is no, your water will still be pure. Or invest in a larger water heater. It means that there is an issue with the air pressure sensor. Both types of systems have similar pros and cons. When I hooked hoses to the service pipes, the system still produced a strong, steady flow of water, seeming to not drain. It is located on the lowest corner opposite the on and off button. Navien NPE-240s with external recirculating pump. - JustAnswer By accepting all cookies, you agree to our use of cookies to deliver and maintain our services and site, improve the quality of Reddit, personalize Reddit content and advertising, and measure the effectiveness of advertising. It can take anywhere from 10 seconds to 1 minute for the hot water to reach the faucet. Eventually, they pay for themselves by reducing the water bills. We might be able to do something about it. The function of a recirculating pump is to ensure that hot water is always available as close to the consumption point as possible, in order to reduce water waste and to increase comfort. Weve tried to include every concern you might have regarding turning off the water recirculating pump.